From:  "Sugir" <Sugir@sbcglobal.net>
Date:  08 Feb 2005 01:22:32 Hong Kong Time
Newsgroup:  news.alt119.net/alt.support.srs
Subject:  

Re: Someone said this place had calmed down...

NNTP-Posting-Host:  null

"Amanda Angelika"  wrote in message news:36pdrfF557pf9U1@individual.net...
> In news:Xns95F62E0C3290ESandra251@151.164.30.94,
> Sandra  typed:
>> PPS. Interesting paragraph about 3/4 of the way down the text.
>> Weren't you just last week, or was it the week before, telling
>> someone that people don't really care if your transgendered or
>> not as long as you're out and confident? So how come some guy
>> got in your face, Laura? Did you do something to provoke him
>> like you generally advocate in here. Did you get in his face
>> too? Or, was it that you lied to him by not telling him you
>> were transgendered and leading him to believe you were
>> something you were not? Or, is it even in your world that
>> transpeople have to be careful about their actions and
>> disclosures? Maybe it's imprudent to come across all
>> confrontational in the real world?
>>
>> (Oh by the way, I haven't had a confrontation like that since
>> way before I transitioned. Now, what could I be doing so
>> wrong?)
>
> Well there is the aspect (which may depend on manner and appearance) that
> most people don't question one's sex and gender and one normally has very
> little indication as to whether people see one as female or think one is
> some sort of tranny. And how people treat you as an individual isn't
> necessarily even an indication of whether or not you have "passed".
>
> I think "passing" and being accepted, has more to do with being oneself,
> than trying to conform to some "ideal" whether that's some "ideal" of
> womanhood (which is always going to be open to question, because these
> "ideals" are usually perceived as being based on sexist notions) or some
> idealised notion of "transgenderhood" which is just as questionable.
>
> Ultimately I think the truth and reality of who and what one is, is *within*
> and such truth or reality becomes evident in what you do.

I know what when I *see* Jenn and Jaz and as I talk to others
on the phone, irrespective some deep voices and even male
genitals, I sense /feminine/. Has little to do with passing, but more
a sense that I get after feeling a person's sincerity.

Sincerity is very hard for most people to fake.  :)

>
> The problem with Laura's ideas is she has a solution that possibly works for
> her, but Laura's  political idealism, whilst it may help people at certain
> stages in their own journey (I'm not running Laura down here), is unlikely
> to work in it's *entirety* for anyone else, because the only genuine and
> truthful way of doing this is to do it your way.
>
> We are the women we are, not who or what we pretend to be, and you can't get
> away from that, there is no point in taking on someone else's belief
> structure or notion of identity. There is only one true identity, one's own.

...and even that is constantly changing, if you believe Buddha.

> It's like "I think therefore I am" Just as in philosophy/theology where we
> posses the reality of Godhood within ourselves, we posses the reality of
> womanhood within, and access to the "truth and light" of this is not
> monopolised in some man-made ideology, religion, or political dogma of any
> kind.
>
> Which is why I think Laura and also Willow and one or two others seem to
> spend far to much time barking up the wrong trees, and perhaps fail to see
> the actual wood :)

                  Kind lovers, love on,
                  Lest the world be undone,
                And mankind be lost by degrees:
                  For if all from their loves
                  Should go wander in groves,
                There soon would be nothing but trees.
                              -- John Crowne

Sugir

>
> -- 
> Amanda
>
>
>
>
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